All right, you could say I take a high moral ground while asking this question, but there it is.
I am a strict vegetarian by choice, and my preference is guided primarily by ethics (“killing animals when they don’t harm us is wrong”). But I am here not to discuss the ethics of vegetarianism (which I will be glad to discuss on My Desk), but the sustainability of being vegetarian.
Apart from the obvious greenhouse gases increase owing to the large number of cattle population because of non-vegetarianism, there could be other aspects that hinder a progress to sustainable world.
So, being vegetarian is not only ethical but also makes the world more sustainable. So, why isn’t the world not turning vegetarian? Is it because they cannot control their taste buds? That sounds like such a crime!
What are your thoughts?
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What do you plan on doing with all the animals, if the world decided to become vegetarians? I believe cattle, pigs, goats, and chickens "farm animals" would become quickly overpopulated. which would increase the green house gasses. I think I know what the problem is you haven't ingested enough real proteins throughout your life, and your brain has suffered underdevelopment as a result.
@Rcollins - I am glad to get it re-confirmed that I am brain dead (assuming I had one in the first place), but here is some interesting news for you - most of the cattle, pigs, goats and chicken that you have mentioned are being grown to be fed to nice and humane chaps who are so worried that their non-eating of meat will make the world go topsy turvy with global warming. So, these are over and above what the world would have had anyway...
@rcollins do you want to know what I plan on doing with all the animals, I am not going to let them reproduce. You said they are farm animals then just stop producing them and shut down the farms. This way you won’t have the overpopulation of animals and consequently no extra green house gases.
What happens to the farms that grow the animals for food?, They loose their income, what happens to the farmers that grow the feed for the animals?, they loose their income, what happens to the leather industry?, They loose their income, and also the same with the other animal by products industries. What happens to the wild animals environment when you dump a huge amount of farm animals in it. The wild plant eating animals die, because they can't compete. It throws everything out of balance. Another point is by farming the domestic animals we control their population, in nature we wouldn't.
Wave: That would probably take several hundered years, or more for that to work. and what do you plan on doing putting them in little pens to keep them from breading?
Wave: That would probably take several hundred years, or more for that to work. and what do you plan on doing putting them in little pens to keep them from breading? Another thing I would like to add, do you plan on taking care of them, and feeding them while they sit in those little pens until the die from old age? If you stopped producing them, they don't just magically disappear.
Some web resources for and against the topic:
==>Vegetarian ==sustainable
http://www.savvyvegetarian.com/articles/sustainable-vegetarian.php
Worldwide, an estimated 2 billion people live primarily on a meat-based diet, while an estimated 4 billion live primarily on a plant-based diet. The US food production system uses about 50% of the total US land area, 80% of the fresh water, and 17% of the fossil energy used in the country. The heavy dependence on fossil energy suggests that the US food system, whether meat-based or plant-based, is not sustainable. The use of land and energy resources devoted to an average meat-based diet compared with a lactoovovegetarian (plant-based) diet is analyzed in this report. In both diets, the daily quantity of calories consumed are kept constant at about 3533 kcal per person. The meat-based food system requires more energy, land, and water resources than the lactoovovegetarian diet. In this limited sense, the lactoovovegetarian diet is more sustainable than the average American meat-based diet - http://www.ajcn.org/content/78/3/660S.full
Is Vegan The Answer To Sustainability? - http://globalpatriot.com/2009/02/22/is-vegan-the-answer-to-sustainability/
==>Vegetarian is not the answer to sustainability
The Vegetarian Myth: Food, Justice and Sustainability - We’ve been told that a vegetarian diet can feed the hungry, honor the animals, and save the planet. Lierre Keith believed in that plant-based diet and spent twenty years as a vegan. But in The Vegetarian Myth, she argues that we’ve been led astray--not by our longings for a just and sustainable world, but by our ignorance - https://secure.pmpress.org/index.php?l=product_detail&p=115
Narsi: You, or Wave never answered my question what do you plan on doing with the farm animals? Are you just going to kill them off, so eveyone can become a vegetarian? Or are you going to put them in little pens to keep them from breeding, which would defeat your globle warming, and water use issues, and would also increase your need for patrolium based fertilizers to grow your vegetables (one of the bi products of farm animals)?
I just read this "lacto ovo vegetarian" they still eat eggs and milk, well were are the eggs and milk going to come from!?----------the sky???? So I guess that shoots down your idea of getting rid of the cows, goat, and chickens.
@rcollins - what happened to typewriter manufacturers after the computer industry came in and essentially destroyed their business? What happened to blokes who owned horse buggies after the advent of the car put them out of business?
Neither of the above committed suicide...of course, some of them went broke. Many of them simply started doing something else, to align themselves to the changed world.
Life's like that - change is painful, but it also throws up opportunities. Depends on which part of the half empty glass you wish to look at - half empty or half full
"I just read this "lacto ovo vegetarian" they still eat eggs and milk, well were are the eggs and milk going to come from!?----------the sky???? So I guess that shoots down your idea of getting rid of the cows, goat, and chickens."
The difference comes in the number of cows you require when you are a lacto-vegetarian vs when you are a meat eater. A cow's flesh could perhaps feed a meat eater's family for a week, but it will feed a lacto-vegetarian's family for 10 years. That's 520 times more, or 519 times fewer cows you require
Narsi the typewriter industry didn't employ tens of thousands of people, maybe even 100 of thousand indirectly, neither did the horse buggy industry. You are suggesting shutting down a huge industry which does, because some twit thinks the world should become vegetarians, based on some trumped up statistics. If you want to be a vegetarian so be it, but that doesn't mean everyone else should be.
Besides the moral implications of meat-eating, if we look at the sustainability issue, it is the classic argument – are we cutting down rainforests and clearing grasslands to make space for agriculture or for livestock?
I remember an old discussion going back at least 4-5 years, where 2 Australian scientists were debating the effect of less meat-consumption on Global Warming. They said that worldwide average meat consumption could be realistically reduced by at least 10% and doing so would decrease the amount of methane gas emitted by livestock – basically through flatulence. Methane is about 20 times a more powerful greenhouse gas than carbon dioxide.
Unfortunately, the demand for meat is increasing worldwide. In China, for instance, people are eating double the amount of meat they used to a decade ago.
I'm guessing it is as much to do with the palate as the perception of eating meat as a luxury that could now be afforded by those with growing incomes...
Arunpillai: I doubt that the amount of methane produced from cows would be enough to effect global warming, not even slightly. The biggest cause of global warming, and environmental distruction is humans, maybe we should get rid of a few of them instead.
Hey Rcollins, I have found a suitable profession for all those blokes who will lose their job if the meat industry were to shut its doors...
No prizes for guesses, they can become farmers and grow vegetarian food for the couple of billion people who do not have anything else to eat now. That's a big enough business mate!
"I think I know what the problem is you haven't ingested enough real proteins throughout your life, and your brain has suffered underdevelopment as a result."
Stick to the topic Mr.Collins - share your thoughts on Vegetarianism & Sustainability. Don't be making personal jabs at other members. Not appreciated.
By the way> what are "Real" proteins? Proteins – or rather Amino acids - are found equally in meats and milk as in plant sources such as beans and legumes. You do not need to eat animal products to get all the protein you need in your diet. Besides, meats provide large amounts of saturated fat, which is a known risk factor for cardiovascular disease and can cause other diseases such as gout and may put a strain on the kidneys.
@rcollins what to do with farm animals? Usually animal farms have total control over breeding of these animals, so there are no issues on controlling their population. And also its not going to take 100 years to solve the problem of existing animals, once we stop producing all the animals will be sold out in day for at least 100 times of their original rate. The issue is not with the population of animals its with the people who are not able to live without meat in the morning.
I have a suggestion (stupid people) the one's that require warning labels in order to survive. Just remove the warning lables and let nature take it's course :)
We can not wait for mercy from the nature after we have made with it
arunpillai: Narsi is a big boy he can defend himself.
Arunpillai: on another note who are you to tell me what I can and cannot say. I believe it is in the constitution of the united states, "the first amendment" that I have the freedom of speech.
In this dispute the serious thing is missed. Not only proteins are necessary. The meat and fish can give to man's organism the largest quantity of irreplaceable amino acids. To receive all complex of amino acids through vegetative food very difficult due to necessary quantity of food and by a necessary variety of vegetative one. As usual, the easiest way was chosen by the nature.
The necessity to break customs, traditions, habits also is very difficult even in case of comprehensive food supplying and acceptable price on it.